Hallo Du! 
Bevor du loslegst den Talk zu transkribieren, sieh dir bitte noch einmal unseren Style Guide an: https://wiki.c3subtitles.de/de:styleguide. Solltest du Fragen haben, dann kannst du uns gerne direkt fragen oder unter https://webirc.hackint.org/#irc://hackint.org/#subtitles erreichen. 
Bitte vergiss nicht deinen Fortschritt im Fortschrittsbalken auf der Seite des Talks einzutragen. 
Vielen Dank für dein Engagement! 

Hey you! 
Prior to transcribing, please look at your style guide: https://wiki.c3subtitles.de/en:styleguide. If you have some questions you can either ask us personally or write us at https://webirc.hackint.org/#irc://hackint.org/#subtitles. 
Please don't forget to mark your progress in the progress bar at the talk's website. 
Thank you very much for your commitment! 

======================================================================== 


All right, everyone, welcome to the top public money public code held by Bonnie and Mathias, and they work for the FSA, and I guess you can start now. Thank you very much. So, yes, my name is not just. I work for Free Software Foundation Europe and does this spawn emerging will also be part of the talk and we are here to present you what we have already done in the Public Money Public Code campaign. What tools are available with the goal to enable you to use them yourself and get active for yourself? So in school, we learned that in Denmark, in a democracy, we elect people for different institutions and then they they have to power over this area. While in a world where more and more things are decided with technology and with software, the situation might look more like this. And so the goal of the offensive is that in governments, in public administrations that the administrations can use the software and control that software in their area. So free software always gives them certain freedoms that a government and public administration can use that software for any purpose so that no third party can decide what the government or the public administration can do with the software and what not. They can always use it for any purpose, for any purpose without getting permission first. They are also allowed to study the software, so to get the source code and see what it actually does, software is really doing to understand what implications certain things have to see if this is right or wrong, what the software is doing and check if the software is in compliance with the laws and regulations they introduced. Furthermore, software free software always gives the governments the freedom to share the software without us, be it the citizens, be it the other public administrations, companies, wherever. And furthermore, that the public administration is always able to improve the software or adapt the software to their own needs. So governments should never be in a situation
 where they cannot do a change in law, in a regulation because a software company or a developer doesn't allow them to do this. So you are always allowed to do it. You can make modifications so that you adopt a software to your needs, and you don't have to change your behavior of the public administration to what someone else, a developer of the software decided. So that's that's the background here. As I said, what we want to present here is what tools are available, what parts of the of the campaign we already have. And our goal is that you can then afterwards also use those tools, be creative and hack your public administration that day afterwards. Also, make sure that software, which is published software, which is financed with public money, will afterwards be published under a free software license, which allows the public administration, but also each one of you and all the other public public administrations to use the software for any purpose to study the source code to share the software with others and to improve it. So, yes, let's start with that. As I said, the the goals we already had for a very long time that besides citizens companies, governments should also receive those four freedoms of free software to use, study, share and improve it. And we lobbied for that for a long time, talked with politicians, people in public administrations. But in 2017, we thought, what can we do to give this goal a push? Can we come up with a campaign to to speed it up? And so what we decided was that we have a campaign workshop about that. We invited lots of volunteers from all over Europe and spend one weekend together. That's our head there, where we noted down several ideas for the slogan. We thought about what components we need for such a campaign. What tools we need. And yeah, I'm one of the outcomes. Boston the the slogan here, which you see there, besides some of us where I feel a little bit embarrassed of what we came up with. But yeah, so that that was at th
e time when we then came up with what we wanted to do, what components we wanted to to have, and under which slogan the public money public code slogan. We want to do this from now on. Some of us started to develop a website. So we wanted to make sure that when there are people who don't have any clue about free software yet, political decision makers, people in public administrations, but also the public, the general public, when they want to learn about this, that they have an easy entrance point for it. So we created this website and our volunteers started to translate it in many languages. So, meanwhile, have 19 languages available there. You see them on the button there. And if any one of you is speaking a language which is not yet listed there, we want you after the talk. Please help us so that we can make 20 or 21 out of that. So yes, that was the first part so that when you talk with people about that, you can point them to a website. The next step was that we started drafting an open letter, which we. Which we want to send to politicians on all different levels. So we started talking with other organizations, develop the draft there, get some feedback, made some small readjustment to the letter. The CCC was one of the first signing it. Are RCO, whom you might also notice when you walk a volunteer, and several of them were then the first initial people who signed it. And the idea there is that for different elections, for whenever there is a good opportunity to contact public administrations or politicians that we can point to the open letter, we can show them how many people and how many organizations are supporting this. And one of the easiest things for you to do if you want to support this campaign is to sign the open letter yourself and encourage others to do so. We are also especially interested in other organizations. Of course, it's very nice if these signing process works as smooth as in this case with Debien, which has received much requests and sa
y yes. But we are also very much interested in non-technical organizations signing this open letter. So not so much out of the usual suspects, but organizations a civil society which also want to support this or or other public administration stem cells. So if you can help us there to get more people signing this demand, that's very helpful for us. Furthermore, we then we also said that we need a short video for people who don't want to read websites who don't want to read open letters. Something very short, very simple. And that's the video. I also want to briefly show you the funnel. For a moment, our government would treat our public infrastructure like our streets and public buildings the same way it treats our digital infrastructure. Our members of Parliament would work in a rented space where they weren't allowed to vote in favor of stricter environmental laws because the owner, a multinational corporation, didn't allow that kind of voting and its buildings. Nor will it allow a long overdue upgrade to more than 500 seats. This means some members of parliament have to stay outside in the street and a couple of blocks away, a brand new gym is already being torn down just six months after it was built. It's being replaced with an exact replica at great expense and the only difference the new manufacturer also provides straightforward as an added feature. Meanwhile, every night, through a hidden backdoor in the city hall, documents that contain sensitive information on citizens from bank data to health care records are being stolen, but no one is allowed to do anything about it because searching for back doors and locking them would infringe the signed user agreement. And as absurd as this sounds when it comes to our digital infrastructure, things like the software and programs that our governments are using every day. This comparison is pretty accurate because mostly our administrations procure proprietary software. This means a lot of money goes into licenses th
at last for a limited amount of time and restrict our rights. We aren't allowed to use our infrastructure in a reasonable way. And because the source code of proprietary software is usually a business secret, finding security holes or deliberately installed backdoors is extremely difficult and even illegal. But a public administrations can do better if all publicly financed software were to be free and open source. We could use and share our infrastructure for anything and for as long as we wanted, we could upgrade it, repair it and remodel it in any way to fit our needs. And because the open source and free software means that the blueprint is openly readable for everyone. This makes it much easier to find and close security holes. And if something practical and reliable was created digitally, not only can you reuse the blueprint all over your country, the actual thing itself can be deployed anywhere, even internationally. A great example of this is Fix My Street, originally developed in Great Britain as a free software app to report, view and discuss local problems like potholes. It's now being used all over the world. Everyone benefits because new features and improvements are shared by everyone. If all our software were developed like this, we could stop struggling with restrictive licenses and could start thinking about where and how software could help us. We could concentrate on creating a better society for everyone. So if you think that tomorrow's infrastructure should be in our own hands, help us now by sharing this video and visiting our website public code top EU. It's time to make our demand public money public code. So, yeah, this video was actually something which was quite difficult for us, so we had many people involved in the campaign. And when we started to think about like what to put in the video, there were lots of people. We can't say it like this. That's too hard, too much simplification there. And in the end, we had to decide that it's just 
a small group of free people from us, plus the person doing the video that we came up with this, which I hope that it's now very easy to understand for politicians, political decision makers and people in public administrations. What we did later in the campaign was that we translated the video in several other languages, so it's now available in English, Spanish, French, Italian, Portuguese and Russian. And thereby, we should, in theory, be able to reach over one billion people in their native language. We are still interested to also have that in other languages. So the costs for that are around €900 if you want to do it professionally. We also had some organizations in other countries who were taking care about debts of one organization was handling this for French. And we also found several people in other countries there who like to complain a lot and then helped us. Yeah, I don't doing it pro bono for a very good price. So, yeah, this video is there. You can use it. And then one other component, which we also which also people started using, was that some, uh, some activists spent their nights playing around with global projectors. There were things where you can play around with light and projected that on buildings. They are also I've already seen some people around here who may have been part of this activities. And so they yeah, they're the reason for that is that it's it gives you your offer. It's have some pictures which you can use when you want to bring that in the in the press talk of out of if the media and and also in general, to have some images for something which is very abstract, like talking about software. So yeah, some people spend their nights in Frankfurt and in Berlin to protect messages on public administrations buildings. And then one one thing we did was that with the open letter and the video, we started contacting politicians for, UM, for the federal elections in Germany in 2017. So I noticed in German I will briefly translate it. S
o d d, what we did there was that we sent an email to all candidates who can be dated for becoming a member of Parliament in the German Bundestag. And one experience we made there is that the the feedback we received from politicians there was quite good. But what even worked better was that we encourage people to contact their direct candidates themselves. And this is an example of a reply and my mother received. So she was also contacting politicians about that and asked them if Dave would be in favor of a publicly financed offer being published under free software licenses. And this was the reply by, um, by a conservative politician who is also secretary of state from that party. And he wrote that it's it's very he's very impressed by the work who her son and if this FSF e are doing and that after the election, he would like to have contact with us and talk with us about this because it's an area where politicians are also dependent on the expertize from from external people. And so that's something which is where you see that with some very small messages, short emails, you can already reach people on a more personal level and and showed him this video. I mean, he was also in the in the email replying, Oh yeah, that video makes sense. I also forwarded it to our experts. Let's see what they say. But I mean, for himself, first of all, the politician said, Look, yeah, that that all makes sense. We should do that. And the same political party, just a few steps forward, a few a few weeks ago took a decision. So it was the CDU and the CDU at their last party convention. They took the decision that publicly finance software should be published under free software licenses and be available for everyone, which was for. A big, big improvement there. Because it's usually if it came from party, which years before our ten years, it was more blocking in this direction. And so that's of course something they say now. And we have to make sure to monitor this and to remind them 
about what they want to do so that actually things are implemented there. But I want to show it to you to to show that it's often to lots of people who have to do something are to to make a change. And it could be one of the small emails which convinces one of the politicians to say yes when this is coming into the party convention and they have to take a decision there. Furthermore, what we also did before this decision already is that on the 14th of February, we always encourage people to thank for software developers for their work. So we call it the Ilove Free Software Day because we think they're not just the flower industry should have some benefits there. And last year, what we did understand was that we prepared letters and roses. And each member of the German parliament received such a letter and arose from us. And in those letters, we explained them about free software, about public money, public code, and asked them to also be more aware about what free software is doing for our society. That was something, again, some opportunity to remind them about this topic and explain them what we have working on. One other component we had was that beside the website and the video and the open letter, we wanted to have something that when politicians or political decision makers in general say, that all makes sense. What can I do next? How can I learn more that we have something to hand over to them for us? So we decided that we wanted to create a brochure with more insight. Text some more details about the topic. So together with other organizations who contributed text for this, we created a brochure for public money, public court for the modernization of the public infrastructure off of our public administrations. And this brochure is it's now available all said our booth. You can hand it over whenever you talk with politicians about this topic and say, here's something more for you or for your assistance to read. And yeah, at the moment it's only available in E
nglish, but we are working on a German translation together with iFit, which is a public admin public body to help public administration to modernize it. So soon, there will also be a German translation, which then hopefully will help people in Germany, Austria and parts of Switzerland to convince more people about this again. So and by that, I'm handing over to Bonnie, our current intern, who worked on this as one of her internship projects. Hello. Thank you for having us on. Oh yeah. All right. And just like doing my internship, as Mattie has already mentioned, I worked on the Public Money Public Code campaign and I managed it as by sending out letters to politicians. I wanted to get in contact with lots of administrations all over Europe to get them to sign the open letter because so far we have only three of them and we want there to be more. Yes. So those three are the addition of other dystopias. I hope I'm pronouncing correctly some commander up March and the city of Barcelona. Wow. Well, how did I do this? I sent out some mails to the politicians all over Europe. I looked up the addresses and I found out if I have any connections with software or free software in the town. I also did this with my hometown, who I'm still in contact with. I basically sent them some basic information about free software as materials already introduced to you. And I also told them about the benefits from free stuff and a public administration like collaboration with other communities, giving back something to the people, saving costs, for example, through collaboration and reducing dependencies. Also too far to support the local economy could be a benefit from it and innovation because you don't need to reinvent the wheel every time if you use free software in the public administration. But then I ended those emails with a question like How is the digital strategy and what are you planning for the next mega station for this? I also created a Vicki page and our wiki so that you f
ind an example, email and also loads of information on how to do this and how to get in contact with politicians. But then I also asked myself, but as politicians, the only, say administrations, we have no, we have more. We have the universities for examples who are entities. So now I need to click and also schools. Those all use public money to fund their IT infrastructure and also libraries. Libraries don't only have books, they actually also use software and hospitals, for example, as well. Those are all public administrations who use public funds for their I.T. infrastructure. I also have some examples currently of Oh, you already saw this picture in the video. By the way, there's a motion in the parliament of Castle. I know it's in Germany and done very late, obviously examples from other countries. And that motion in the city parliament, of course, asked the magistrate to follow the guiding principle of being busy by the purchase and development of new free software out of new software. Sorry. So today you buy new free software. Well, there will be a vote on this in the middle of January and a responsible committee, and in the end of January in the city parliament, this was already postponed a few times. So there's still time for all of you who live in the area of castle to get active and write off some emails we already did. And we will be happy to have if you have any questions there, as I have another success story from a heckler called Pica Pica in Asturias, as always, had a serious sign. Department of a serious side of letter and they asked their. Parliament to do this, they got in contact with their politicians as well and told them about the benefits, some parties were more interested in saving costs or support the local economy and others very much interested in collaboration of others. And they used all these arguments with two parties and got in contact with them and convinced them eventually to be the first parliament to sign the open letter. For th
is, we have an interview on our web page and you can look up the whole story there. Then I also have another example that's currently happening in the parliament of Luxembourg. There's a motion that says we invite the government to actively promote and support free and open source software and public administrations, and to publish every new developed software which was financed from public funds as open source software. Currently, there are three at least three opposition parties the Pirates who have two seats, this SVP who have 21 seats and delink. I hope I pronounce it correctly. Q. You have two seats as well that are supporting does this motion and also Viviane Reding, a former EU commissioner from Disease V, is speaking in favor for the motion. So they're all examples where you can still get active and write some emails. And if you are now motivated to do this to get in contact with your local administration, as a result, there could be any administration it could be in university or school or your hospital or your library and your local hometown where you're from. You can come to our booth and you find information material there. You can talk to me and I'm always happy to help you with this. And you thought you will also find information on our Wiki page that I created for this, and we are always happy to hear about stories like that. Yes, Rufus. And amid speculation that I was here in the cluster about freedom in the Seattle. So I mean, we showed you some examples of what we already have there. As I said before, we would be interested for you to see what you can make out of that. You should be aware that changing things in public administration, it's a steep, stony, rocky, long way because for many, many years they were driving in a one way road. And it's very difficult for them to make changes, come out of doors, bend or lock ends. They they drove into. And so be aware that when you reach out to politicians, to political decision makers, to people in public 
administrations, some of them will not understand what you want to talk about. Some of them will don't want to talk with you about that. Some might say yes, but how should I do that? There are so many reasons why we can't do that so it can be quiet. You have to be aware that it's something which takes a lot of time, and it will not be like when you try to convince public administrations. When you contact some, there might be 20 of them who say no or who are not interested in what you want to talk with them about. But there might be then one or two where you are successful and where you can make a change. And in the end, it's I mean the FSF Eve. We are working on this. Many people in Europe are working on this campaign. We hope that we can encourage you to also be part of that for some time, to support us to walk this way with us to to make sure that all the others are proceeding with that, that we can make changes there and that we can make sure that public administrations will publish software under free software licenses so that everybody of us will benefit from that and other public administrations will benefit from that. And I mean, that's one of the qualities which my first teacher wrote down for me at that time, an African saying many small people in many small places to many small things that will alter the face of the world. So please don't wait for some hero as some other people to do some changes to fix some things which you think are important, but rather do something today, something small. Start now to to do something dear. And in the end, it's the sum of all those activities from all of us that will make a change, not some big activity by some person or one big organization. It will be rather the combined sum of all the activities, the small things which all of us will do together. So I hope that you will start today with this. And now we have some time to talk with you about your questions. Yes, looking forward to this? Thank you very much. And also, 
thanks a lot to all the supporters of the FSF who made it possible for us to come to here. Thank you. OK, so we have sometimes left for questions, you can see a microphone over there and over there. You can go there to ask questions. Yeah, the microphone to the left. Hey, thanks first for your engagement for free software and to you and on to the FCC. My question would be when talking to officials, I often hear, OK, but we need to suspend now. And if you do not buy the software from this commercial industry, then we will have the problem that no one else will develop it and it will stop developing it for us or afford to us to very high prices because we want to have it open source. What do you answer to this? Complain. Hmm. I mean, there are definitely cases where something like that is the case so that they say, Well, we we want to procure software for this area. They asked us to provide us for this at the moment. And they say, Well, we know that there are just two providers and we will not offer it as free software. So it's very difficult for the public administration to do something about it. I think for it, it depends a lot on the area there. There are areas where the software is a lot of influence on our society, where we should also push political decision makers more to make this mandatory that the software needs to be under free software license. There are other areas where maybe we don't have to focus our resources on this case at the moment, because there are others where it makes more sense to focus on them to also find some examples where it's easier to to do it as free software. So you can already show people what benefits they have from this sort of public administrations, how how much they can benefit from that so that over the time they build up competency, how to deal with that and can then also easier to tackle those difficult problems. But as I said, I think there are areas in which the software has a huge impact on society and on the people's liv
es where we should not just accept how well the companies say no, but where we should think hard about if we should not invest more resources, more money in this, that we develop solutions like that as free software that we also reach out to other administrations all over Europe and think about if maybe resources could be combined to tackle such a problem today. Thank you. OK, now for the microphone on the right. Thanks, guys, for your for your work on this topic. The question I have is do you have some resource on positive examples of software that is already Open-Source and used in a lot of administrations that you can refer to when trying to convince people there was already mentioned to fix my street in the video, for example? And for us, I have to think to, you know, I mean, in in the brochure, we mentioned some examples of of software, which is widely used. So there are some, some standards there is there is on the European level, the sharing and reuse of art. And it's something where the European Commission, they give out awards to public administrations who develop software, which is then also reused by other public administrations in Europe, and lots of them are published on a free software licenses. So I would encourage you to have a look at those examples there. I'm a bit I'm a bit hesitant to to mention concrete examples because one of the one of the experience we made was that sometimes people, they just look at some of those projects. And for example, if Munich before where lots of people always Munich, it's the Lightning and lighthouse project of free software. And and then everybody's looking at that and they don't look around what else is happening. And then then through political changes, things are not going that well for one of those projects. Then then people are so disappointed and think that this this one thing, that's that's the big part there. And I mean, I'm I'm convinced that we don't need those those big lighthouses, but that we have many
 stars in the in the sky where people are doing something good in public administration. So look at those those winner, those winners of those awards, look in our brochure, what examples there are and then find those which which you like personally because they are from an area which which you care about and then use them to explain this. Yeah, it's OK. I was looking for like a list with all these projects to hand over, like a list to to show that this is a big thing and not only individual projects. Exactly like I said, you know, you don't have a list on your website, do you? Because it's in the brochure, there are examples and there are also references to other resources like, for example, the European Commission has joined up, which published case studies about free software usage in the European Union. So those are very good resources to find good examples for yourself. Thanks. All right. Are there any questions from the internet? No. OK, then let's go with the microphone on the left. Thanks for the talk. I'm interested in working in this area, but I do not know about any funding. Like is there a European German funding that like will allow to fund a company or just work and get money from the European Union? When you have an project idea, are to work on a project to finance yourself. You mean that you want with your company to develop free software for the public administration, for example. Like that you you can live off of it, but do it in your free time after 40 hours to 40 hours for that. Hmm. So. When you want to make money for free software in this area, you have to follow the same procedures as other companies have to. So there is a procurement process, you have to make your bit, they are into procurement processes and some public. I mean, our goal is that public administrations will say more often that they want to have free software for this and that they don't allow proprietary software for those solutions so that when you are making an offer that you
 have disadvantage there, that you don't have to compete with other with other companies who don't want to provide those those rights to the public administrations. But there are we don't at the moment do anything to audit that free software that companies themselves address any any program to teach us to make money with providing free software to public spaces, because that would be something which is against the procurement laws there. I mean, there are some smaller things where you can get funding. For example, there is the Our Project Funding Opportunities for Free Software project about new internet technologies, which might also be something for public administrations. 50 next generation internet. You can apply there for funds. That's one thing where we also involved to help with license issues and there is for like smaller things and it's very, very new. You can also funding from the D prototype fund to develop some software, which can afterwards be used for the public administration. But beside that, I mean, you have to go the normal way. Our goal is to increase the demand for free software in the public administration and to have also regulation that it's very difficult to to procure proprietary software. Thank you. All right, then let's go with the microphone on the right again. Hello. So you probably know that in Italy, since that June of this year, we have a law that's required in most of the case to use the re-use and implement free software from the public administration. So somehow that there's a law. So we are entering into a new phase where there is the need to monitor the implementation of the law and to act when the law is not respected because almost no single authority have the duty to control this kind of very complicated the software and public procurement law related things. We want the way we are going to implement a project that would make our monitoring community around that. But I wanted to ask if there are other existing initiatives that
 already entered into this phase of monitoring public procurement of software acting on it legally. And I mean, not just advocating for it, but enforcing it from a civil society perspective from having a center. Yeah, yeah. So yes, we are in contact with don't know with whom exactly from you, but we are in contact with the family center. Probably OK with you. Perfect. Thank you very much for your work there. I mean that that's something which is very important now that whenever we we reach the state that a law is introduced or party is making a commitment that we monitor this, remind them about that and and see how this is actually going. So I mean, for Italy, this law that before you as a procurement, that government added public administration should check if other public administrations already have a software which fulfills this need. Else, they should check if there's free software available to to make to to make to solve this problem. And just if that is not the case, then they are able to procure proprietary software. Now the thing is always in in political processes, you have a law, so it's somewhat formulated something. You have a decision about something and then comes the part about policy implementation. And that's the part which is most complicated and where most policy fail. So it's not so much that people don't, cannot vote yes or no. We want to have this or not. It's the problem is in the implementation phase, and that will be the hardest part. And there we need the help of many people, many organizations, to monitor what is actually going on there, too. Then again, remind them about that to readjust laws, to think about what other things can be done to, to make the right incentives. So I mean, some some laws are, they are. They say it's forbidden to do this. Others are. They are like, if you do it that way, then you have a lots of benefits. So we have to see how, how to make such changes in a way that is sustainable, that the public administration i
s not so much forced to do something by law, but that they that. They see that they have advantages when doing that and that they want to do that, and it will be easier. So yeah, in that case. Thanks a lot. Already today, the Hamas center was which is working on this for for Italy. We hope that we are able to monitor that for other countries as well, together with other organizations. So, yeah, support organizations like Hamas Center and others who are doing this. So if there are still no questions from the internet, no, then we'll go with one on the left again. Thank you, Bonnie and Matthias. And there are initiatives, even big ones. So if you don't focus your business on public money, then actually, I believe there's more money in open source consulting than in proprietary consulting. We made this experience and now can you come a bit closer? It's yeah, and there is. And the moment Germany, together with France, is starting to gain initiative, which was a little bit ridiculous because nobody expected us from the German government, and I think they had to learn a lot of details about this initiative. And there is a lot of money waiting to be pumped into the open source communities on the other side. We make the experience at the open source community is not prepared, for example, to maintain projects in a stable state for 50 years. We are talking about projects which are critical infrastructure, which means you have 20 years of maintenance to guarantee, let's say, Paisan for 20 years. And then normally these things are extended to up to 50 years. So what you believe, says Popov three, is supported for 50 years. We have to change a maintenance problem on the other side of property. Proprietary software vendors have the same problem, but you find Windows 95 systems and critical infrastructure, which have not been updated for 25 years if I compute right. So there is a big pressure and the politik has recognized it. So but we have to organize business into the communit
ies which are not prepared to do business. So my opinion is you cannot do anything without doing business, even in open source. And we have to prepare the open source community for playing well with some money, which is available in a way that they can take it and maintain it in the fairway. Yep. But I I think that's, yeah, that's important. OK, so we'll just take the next question from the mike on the right. Hello. Just a quick example of a project. And OpenStreetMap, I think, is a very good example. So it's a completely open mouth, and I think there's a lot of cases where that could be used in public administration. I know all the trial information, maps and Dublin harvest, and I want to ask, is there a plan to bring public money public codes to the EU level? Because I think it's next year, the seven year budget, the Multiannual Financial Framework is going to be renegotiated, so it might be worthwhile just pushing the requirement for a public code in there. And also, could we look at developing pan-European tendering processes for open source? And could we develop that? So say five or six administrations from different parts of Europe would work together to put together a joint tender to say, improve an open source project if their needs were similar? I don't know. Had someone tell us about that, sir, could we maybe develop the policy of this term to that? It's a policy level. And so, I mean, we already are in contact with the European level. We are talking with politicians there and also contacted them with those demands and our thinking about how to move forward. I mean, you have already the sharing and re-use of art by the European Commission, where they say the sharing and reuse should be the default for public administrations. So that's something where we are encouraging them to go forward there and help them how to do this. And we also next year we want to to reach more members of the parliament and think about how to how to establish this then after. Now m
ost of the politicians got a bit. Yeah, understood to be told institutions work. And now you can also start with them working on on the content. So we plan if we if we are able to get funding for our next year, we want to make sure that every member of Parliament gets this pressure that every member of Parliament will be when when they are in the right working groups, that they will be contacted. So that's something where we want to do this. And we also I mean, we hope that by spreading the news, encouraging people to contact their members of the European Parliament as well, that we will make a bigger impact there. The the second question was about let me think tendering at the tendering. Yeah, so like different countries working together on an open source tender. So sometimes in something like that works that you will bring a few people, a few public administrations together and then think about that they share the costs and procure software. But in a lot of cases, this also slows down the process and makes it very difficult. And the failure rate is very high. So you have and you have seven people and they say what they want to have for a project, and then they start with something and then you say, OK, we have to make some compromises. It's way more difficult to find to to take a decision with seven administrations, then if you have one or two. So that's something which I'm a bit hesitant to do this as a first step. I would at the moment rather encourage public administrations for their smaller projects to do this before a software and get us some experience there and then think about enlarging it, doing it, pooling it, doing it together with others. Because else I see that the failure rate will be way higher if you if you combine this because I mean, from the experience public administrations to this process, they are often a bit slow and the process are complicated. And as for software companies, public administrations are not always the the best customers on th
is regard. And when you then don't have, like one public administration as a customer, but you have seven. That's that's for us something where we are very yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, it's difficult. One last thing to the first question that that's what I was talking about. We also need you to step in and get in contact with your entities in the European Parliament because we can do this. Yes, and we are and we are going to do this, but we need more and we need you because many people in many places can bring back. Things can do big things. Very yes. So we have about two minutes left, which fits quite nicely since we have one more question on the left microphone. Yeah, thank you very much for the presentation and for the campaign. I think it's not only sensible, but definitely necessary and coming back to your point about what we can do. I would like to talk to some of the decision makers or local politicians, and I think the brochure would be very helpful at that moment. You said that the German translation is in progress yet. How would I go about receiving an actual sort of printed copy to take with me once that has happened? You can go to our website and there you find the contribute and spread the web page and then you can order some. You can also go to the public code website Pubblicata, the EU and you find also spread the word and there you can order all the promo material and to send it to you for free. Thank you very much. You're welcome and you can also come by at our booth. We have some copies at our booth, together with some other advertisement materials for popping money, puppy code, lots of stickers, T-shirts, bags and so on. And yeah, in general, when you sign the open letter, we also try to keep you up to date of what is happening when you do this and you will also get information. Then, for example, a German citizen at a German translation of the brochure is available. Yeah, so those are ways to do there. So I think just one last word. Use those tools. G
et creative. Heck, you're a public administration there and let us know what experience you make. Give us some feedback so we can readjust our our tools so we can think about what else is needed for this. And don't wait. Just think about now. Whom could I contact my member of Parliament, local politician, public administration and start doing it? Thank you very much.